Comments on: Social Justice vs. Self-Ownership: The Case of Libertarians Great and Small http://bleedingheartlibertarians.com/2012/02/social-justice-vs-self-ownership-the-case-of-libertarians-great-and-small/ Free Markets and Social Justice Sat, 20 Jan 2018 22:11:00 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=4.9.2 By: Chong http://bleedingheartlibertarians.com/2012/02/social-justice-vs-self-ownership-the-case-of-libertarians-great-and-small/#comment-32717 Mon, 08 Jul 2013 03:19:22 +0000 http://bleedingheartlibertarians.com/?p=2002#comment-32717 …A Friend recommended your blog…

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By: anarchobuddy http://bleedingheartlibertarians.com/2012/02/social-justice-vs-self-ownership-the-case-of-libertarians-great-and-small/#comment-26809 Mon, 25 Feb 2013 23:38:00 +0000 http://bleedingheartlibertarians.com/?p=2002#comment-26809 I hope I am not writing in violation of the “Pre-emptive Remarks” but I really question whether such a stark distinction between haves and have-nots will last long in a completely free market. I think this is an important point.

As an illustration, I was not impressed with David Friedman’s critique of property rights as the basis of a legal order. He gave hypothetical situation of choosing between respecting private property and letting the world get hit by an asteroid or taking a briefcase that had the button to destroy the asteroid without permission. If one would choose the latter, this would show that property rights aren’t ultimate. But by being able to stipulate scenarios of complete fantasy, one could construct counter-examples to any theory of ethics.

Now, I’m not stating that the given scenario is pure fantasy, but if it is presenting a situation which characterizes markets with outcomes that are unrealistic, then I think it is forcing us into making false choices.

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By: Morality for Grown Ups | Bleeding Heart Libertarians http://bleedingheartlibertarians.com/2012/02/social-justice-vs-self-ownership-the-case-of-libertarians-great-and-small/#comment-21715 Tue, 21 Aug 2012 13:28:38 +0000 http://bleedingheartlibertarians.com/?p=2002#comment-21715 […] of ourselves as property rights absolutists. Sure, we think coercive redistribution is bad. But in certain cases and in certain forms, we’re willing to tolerate it. So where’s the line? Once we admit […]

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By: Bleeding Heart Libertarians = Left-Statists « Politics & Prosperity http://bleedingheartlibertarians.com/2012/02/social-justice-vs-self-ownership-the-case-of-libertarians-great-and-small/#comment-18264 Wed, 30 May 2012 20:06:37 +0000 http://bleedingheartlibertarians.com/?p=2002#comment-18264 […] John Tomasi. And see also the numerous blog posts from Jason (here, here, and here), Kevin Vallier (here and here) and me (here, here, here and […]

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By: Some Final Thoughts | | Cato Unbound http://bleedingheartlibertarians.com/2012/02/social-justice-vs-self-ownership-the-case-of-libertarians-great-and-small/#comment-16230 Mon, 30 Apr 2012 15:04:07 +0000 http://bleedingheartlibertarians.com/?p=2002#comment-16230 […] John Tomasi. And see also the numerous blog posts from Jason (here, here, and here), Kevin Vallier (here and here) and me (here, here, here and […]

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By: The Evil of Bleeding Heart Libertarianism | Bleeding Heart Libertarians http://bleedingheartlibertarians.com/2012/02/social-justice-vs-self-ownership-the-case-of-libertarians-great-and-small/#comment-16086 Fri, 27 Apr 2012 16:33:29 +0000 http://bleedingheartlibertarians.com/?p=2002#comment-16086 […] social justice you endorse. But Kevin Vallier and I like to illustrate it via counterfactuals. See here (Kevin) and here (me). I’ll quote and slightly modify my own post because it’s shorter. […]

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By: marklebar http://bleedingheartlibertarians.com/2012/02/social-justice-vs-self-ownership-the-case-of-libertarians-great-and-small/#comment-13900 Wed, 15 Feb 2012 14:27:00 +0000 http://bleedingheartlibertarians.com/?p=2002#comment-13900 Matt, this is what gives me this impression:

However, through no one person or group’s deliberate action, prosperity ebbs. Perhaps because of resource depletion, climate change or natural disaster, a class of individuals becomes systematically deprived of basic resources (call them the Small). But while they are regularly hungry, they do not starve. And while they cannot secure many basic health resources, they do not die from easily preventable diseases. However, their poverty substantially sets back their well-being.But the trouble in LP strikes the best-off as well (call them the Great). They too grow poorer, though they remain very well-off, more than wealthy enough to maintain a high standard of living. Yet they no longer feel secure enough to donate to charity. While the Great continue to donate to charity, LP’s charitable institutions no longer have sufficient resources to adequately provide for the Small.As I understand him, it’s not the case that the pie is growing but the slices are getting more disproportionate. That would be one story. But I take this story to be that the pie is getting smaller overall, resulting in smaller slices for both Great and Small. Hence my response.

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By: Matt Zwolinski http://bleedingheartlibertarians.com/2012/02/social-justice-vs-self-ownership-the-case-of-libertarians-great-and-small/#comment-13899 Wed, 15 Feb 2012 13:58:00 +0000 http://bleedingheartlibertarians.com/?p=2002#comment-13899 “In this world, cooperation is not sufficient to make people generally better off.” 

I actually didn’t get this out of Kevin’s post. We can grant that cooperation tends to make people better off and still worry about what happens to particular individuals or classes of individuals outside this general tendency. In Kevin’s society, cooperation has made people generally better off, but certain circumstances have rendered a class of people vulnerable, and the question is what we should do about them. 

I don’t see this as a lifeboat situation in the sense of being an exceptionally rare or unrealistic scenario. It might not be as fundamental as the question of “what causes boats to rise generally,” but the question of “what to do about boats that don’t rise” is still one that a theory of justice seems like it ought to cope with.

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By: Liberty, Negative Rights, and Bleeding Hearts « Politics & Prosperity http://bleedingheartlibertarians.com/2012/02/social-justice-vs-self-ownership-the-case-of-libertarians-great-and-small/#comment-13884 Tue, 14 Feb 2012 14:55:05 +0000 http://bleedingheartlibertarians.com/?p=2002#comment-13884 […] to deny that they favor the enforcement of positive rights by a coercive state. But they do. A post by Kevin Vallier (one of the Bleeding Heart Libertarians) exemplifies their acrobatics: […]

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By: Keith Gardner http://bleedingheartlibertarians.com/2012/02/social-justice-vs-self-ownership-the-case-of-libertarians-great-and-small/#comment-13821 Sun, 12 Feb 2012 02:35:00 +0000 http://bleedingheartlibertarians.com/?p=2002#comment-13821 if the wealthy fund and propagandize a movement for the wealthy, it is unlikely the poor will be about to propagandize a movement to have as many members. they’ll just put more libertarian activists on the payroll like how they just put more cops on payroll rather than remedy the problem which cause a need for more cops.

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